Episode 40: Bring Your Whole Self To Work: Multiple Identities & Human Design with Mel McSherry
Do you struggle with your personal and professional identity?
➡️One person at work
➡️Another outside of work
When what you really want is to show up just as a complete person, right?!
This week on the podcast I invited my friend Mel McSherry to join me and discuss identities:
✨What identity is
✨Outside of work
✨Incorporating it inside of work
✨Finding Balance
✨Feeling a sense of completeness
As well as how as a leader you can support your team in their individual identity.
Schedule a Free Virtual Coffee with Mel - https://calendly.com/melmcsherry/vc
Find about more about Mel and her work here - https://www.melmcsherry.com
Follow Mel on LinkedIn-https://www.linkedin.com/in/melmcsherry/
Follow Mel on Instagram- https://www.instagram.com/mel_mcsherry
Full Transcript:
I am so excited for you to hear this fun conversation I just had with my friend, Mel McSherry. Mel is an international business and life guide author, speaker, and podcast host. Their purpose is to help inspired entrepreneurs honor their lives and be the architect of their success by utilizing a spiritual tool called human design in partnership with traditional business development tools. As an entrepreneur, since 2010, Mel is proud to say that they have created a life by design all while raising their 12 year old son, their passion is to guide others on how to also create the business. Uh, money and life they want while being profitable, mentally, emotionally, and financially every day. I'm so excited for you to hear this conversation where we talked about all things, bringing your right, all of your identities into the workplace. Using this human design tool that i am just totally obsessed with i'm so excited for you to listen let's dive on in
[00:01:57] Nicole Case: Welcome back to the upgraded leader podcast. I'm your host, Nicole case. And today I am joined by my good friend, Mel McSherry. Oh, my gosh. I feel like this conversation has been just. Such a long time coming, and I'm just so, so thrilled that you are here today, Mel. Thank you. I'm so excited, and I feel like, yes, this conversation is a long time coming, but also I'm very excited for people to get an insight into the kinds of conversations that we tend to have together, because they're some of my absolute favorites every time.
[00:02:27] Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. So today we're going to talk about Identity, what all that means, you know, our work identities, you know, you know, our identities outside of work. How can we bring them inside of work? All of these things? How can we find some balance, um, or find, you know, a great level of, um. Of completeness around, around all of this and not be so wrapped up in one or the other.
[00:02:51] But first, before we kind of dive into all of this, I just kind of want to hear about your own upgraded career journey and, you know, just kind of tell us like where you started and how, what you're doing today and kind of how you got there. Yeah. So I have been an entrepreneur, uh, since 2010, 2000. 13. My bad.
[00:03:11] Uh, no, 2010. Anyway, I feel like time doesn't matter or exist anymore. What is time? I have no idea. What is time? Right. It's a, it's a complete, it's a completely made up construct anyway. Yeah. Basically I've been doing this for a hot minute and I actually did start, I tried the corporate aspect. So I was in the fitness industry.
[00:03:28] I was a certified personal trainer and I did work at a corporate gym here in Chicago for about a year. Realized that working for anyone else other than myself was just complete and utter nonsense and broke off and started doing my own thing. So I was doing in home trainings, outdoor boot camps, bridal boot camps, whole nine yards.
[00:03:49] Um, and then when my son was born in 2011, I was married at the time and his father works in major league baseball in the PR department. So he's gone every single home game, takes every other way trip. It's gone two months straight for spring training. And our son was born in the middle of a baseball season.
[00:04:08] And I'm not originally from Chicago, so I had no family here. And it was basically like. Here is a new life and no instruction manual. Um, so sprinkle in a little bit of undiagnosed postpartum depression and we were having ourselves a party. Uh, so I ended up actually taking a step to the side and I like to say step to the side because I really don't believe in step backs.
[00:04:28] Um, and Started doing some online business work just to kind of make ends meet. So I was being, I was a VA for an it company, um, in Dallas, Texas, and I did some online medical billing for my father's company that was located in Arizona. It was so fun. Um, and I, I mean, I, I, they made it work in the sense of where I could kind of wrap my head around this new chapter in my life, but it definitely wasn't, you know, getting me.
[00:04:56] Like judged up for the rest of the day. And so I started taking that time to just really refocus on what did I want. So I understood, you know, where I'm at now, what did I want? What did this look like now? And that turned into actually partnering with a network marketing company called Beachbody. And I was an online health and fitness coach for them.
[00:05:16] I personally enjoyed my experience. Um, I learned a lot about myself and what not to do in business as well as what to do. And unbeknownst to me, that was the first step into the universe showing me the path that I am on right now. Cause I originally thought I was just going to be in health and fitness the rest of my life.
[00:05:37] I wasn't interested in the whole team building thing. I didn't think I was. Anybody to tell anyone how to build their own business. I just wanted to help people be healthier and kind of do my own thing. But because I was so successful at being a health and fitness coach, making all of my sales, I was probably one of the top salespeople in the team that I was on.
[00:05:58] My leader asked me to just do a quick training on how do I get this done? I'm a new mom. I'm a single mom, quote unquote. And yet I hit, you know, these rankings every single month. And I honestly didn't think anything of it. I didn't even really know how to make a training video about it. She's like, well, just do like a day in the life of Mel.
[00:06:18] And so that's what I did. And what ended up happening is me starting to see the framework of kind of the quote unquote foundations of how I now guide in business. So we made that video, she put it up on the new coach bootcamp and all of a sudden our team just exploded. And people wanted to start naturally working with me.
[00:06:40] Our team became like the top 1 percent of the company the next year. And all of a sudden I was just really jonesing on this whole business coaching thing. And beautifully through Beachbody, I was able to have a year long internship with John C. Maxwell, who is one of the oldest, probably original gurus in the business coaching industry.
[00:07:02] Really understood what business coaching was, really fell in love with it. And 2015, I was in the middle of my divorce and figured out, you know what? There's any time to maneuver because I had both feet in, you know, both sides. It was now. So I ended up blessing and releasing Beachbody. I started my business coaching, uh, in 2016 with the original idea that I was just going to work with people and network marketing because.
[00:07:31] There is so much potential for building what you want, but it's so easy to get caught up in kind of the copy and paste, loving style, Hey girl kind of business. Um, and that went well, but then I just started working with more entrepreneurs in general. And then for myself personally, in about, about 2018, 2017, I discovered a tool called human design and that revolutionized.
[00:07:59] Myself first and gave me a whole new perspective on not only how to work my business, but how to guide others to create. What they want. So moving away from these foundational, I have these four steps to success, blah, blah, blah, to let me show you, you, and then let me help you stick to who you are as you create the business and money in life that you want.
[00:08:24] And that's been my main framework. Now, um, I came out of the spiritual closet on LinkedIn in 2020 and I've just been, you know, expanding in that space ever since. And it's such a joy because I absolutely love to. Help inspired entrepreneurs honor their lives and be the architect of their success and really show them how their individuality is their key moneymaker, their key profitability points.
[00:08:51] And to kind of turn away and walk away from these very. Traditional formulaic things that we've been indoctrinated in the entrepreneurial space. Yeah. So I love, I love your story and I love hearing it. And, um, you and I met, I think, oh gosh, in the middle of the pandemic. Yeah. 2021 maybe. Um, and I heard you speak, bought your book a whole nine yards.
[00:09:19] Um, but what I, I love. Myself didn't come into, um, human design until just maybe a couple of months ago or maybe a year or so, I would say now. And I kept saying, I need to get a reading from Mel. I need to get a reading from Mel. And I finally did a couple of months ago and it's just been just so amazing just for, for me and my own business and how I'm architecting, you know, you know, how I want to run this business in my way.
[00:09:48] And it. It just matches so beautifully with how I coach my own clients who are prime primary. I mean, I do have some, some, um, some, uh, entrepreneur clients, but primarily I'm working with, with those who are in corporate. And I think. In the corporate space as well, we're also like indoctrinated on we have to show up in a certain way to be, you know, be professional.
[00:10:15] And like, what does that mean? Who gets to decide, you know, who polices that? Right? So, like, we are fed all of these messages, even in corporate around, you know, this is how this is, what? What it's like to, to do corporate, the corporate life and what I'm talking to my clients about are, you know, you have your own way of communicating.
[00:10:35] You have your own way of leading. You have your own way of influencing your own way of, of approaching a particular problem or decision or situation. And that is your. You're that's your moneymaker. That's how you differentiate yourself from everyone else in your, in your space. Right. So I love just kind of how all of this kind of flows together.
[00:10:57] Um, so nicely and just compliments compliments everything so nicely, which is what brought us to this conversation around identity and, you know. I think that we, I think, I know I personally struggle with what is identity? Like, I don't even know what it means. What's all, what is it all about? The only thing that I can tell you is that in my, at least for my chair and even as, even as, as a business owner and, or as a corporate professional, what I am experiencing out there, both with myself and clients is that people get their, the work identity, like really wrapped up in their worth.
[00:11:33] Like believing that, you know, What I do for a living, what I do to make money, that is me. That is all of me and we have a hard time. And then when something happens, because there's so many things in business and in corporate that are outside of our control, that when something happens. You know, kind of on the negative side of things, whether we lose a job or something just changes at work or, you know, we become mothers or just something changes.
[00:12:01] Like there's a big transition point and all of a sudden our identity shifts and we're like, Oh, shoot, I'm not even quite sure what this looks like anymore. And then we start to kind of unravel a little bit. So, yeah. So kind of like, first, like, how would you, you know, I even just define what identity means, like, what is our identity?
[00:12:21] How do we determine that? What is it all made up of? So I, I absolutely love this conversation because I mean, we talked about kind of my, my entrepreneurial journey, but man, my journey with my identity has like heroes journey. Right. And it was definitely in the beginning, even in my entrepreneurial journey.
[00:12:41] It was defined by these main themes, right? So as someone, I now identify as a non binary woman. As I started, I was, you know, I was a female speaker. I was a woman in business. And having that title was very importance to me and making sure that, um, I, when I walked into the room, I represented that title.
[00:13:07] Right. And when I started then exploring other, you know, other ways to describe myself, all of a sudden I realized that titles to me were very comforting and yet they were never coming from myself. They were always coming from. Other spaces or spaces that I fit into where we would step back. And I think those of us who are raised, you know, um, from a female, female identification, we are, we're raised like that.
[00:13:34] We're ways to figure out how to be in a room and either not stand out or stand out just enough. And when you start adding titles to that, all of a sudden to your point. Our entire personality almost wraps around it, and when that shifts, it is huge. When I became a mom, the struggle I had with that title.
[00:13:53] We'll have another episode we can do on that. So where I feel your identity comes from, first it comes from you. And the reason why we tend not to go there first is because we don't have the information. Honestly, I don't even think we trust ourselves. We like to see how others see us first and then react from there.
[00:14:17] And I'm not saying that's necessarily a bad thing in human design. There are five different types. One of those types, which is what I am is called a projector. We actually can't really see our self worth. We do have to receive that validation from others, but it's finding those trusted sources, right? And there's ways within your chart to make sure that you're in those trusted sources.
[00:14:39] But your identity first comes from you and all of those different facets are so beautiful. And all of them are what make you. It's not segregated from business to professional. It's not segregated from title to this. It is all of you. So first, embracing. And enjoying all of those pieces and knowing that the mix is gonna shift.
[00:15:03] Mm hmm. I think that's another thing as well, is that some people feel like, well, this is my personality, this is who I am in every single room. Yes, and you still need to know your audience. Because why would you waste your energy on a space where you're not going to be received well? And if you took two seconds to just kind of serve and just see, really, is this a space that's really going to receive me?
[00:15:25] Well, and if not, do I even need to be in this space or what can I do to at least support whoever I'm there with or what have you, it gives us still that profitability. When I say profitability, I mostly mean mentally and emotionally. Um, financially is obviously there, but. In this reference for sure, finding that mental emotional profitability in those everyday situations and understanding the more that you know yourself, the more you can recognize those rooms in those spaces quicker and the more that you can just start automatically reserving your energy and your time for those spaces and reserving them when you know you're not in the right ones.
[00:16:04] So I think it's just really coming from, again, understanding yourself first, and then seeing now that you know, your, I'm almost seeing like a chemical compound, right? That you're able to kind of mix them in different jars and spending on what space that you're, you're in. Yeah, absolutely. And I, and I think sometimes like I'll talk to people about authenticity, you know, I'm a certified authentic leadership coach.
[00:16:28] And so sometimes people are like, well, you know, if I can't talk about this thing or I can't, you know, that makes me feel inauthentic. And, and I think to your point, if you're in a room that's not going to value that piece of your identity, then of course you're going to feel. Really inauthentic. You're not going to feel safe to be able to express that piece of your identity fully, but yet at the same time, you don't have to always lean on that particular identity if the, if the situation doesn't call for it, and that's okay too, right?
[00:16:58] Like, I think there's, it's almost like a mindset around it. That like, it's okay that like, you don't always have to go into all of these other, all these other pieces of your identity because we're really a complex people. And um, and again, to your point, you know, check out your audience. If this is, if, if, if this is the piece of your identity that you want to lean into.
[00:17:17] For this, for this purpose, for, for this place, that's cool. It's not being inauthentic. It's just, you know, shifting when the situation calls for it. So long as you aren't feeling like I'm not showing up with that identity purely because I think I'm going to be judged or it's not safe, not safe to do it.
[00:17:37] Yeah, no, a hundred percent. And also, you know, kind of going back to the human design aspect of it, which you've seen, is that, you know, in human design, chakras is one of the five charts that we use. And one of the things that I found for myself is I have what's called an open throat. Center, which means that's not a, even though I'm a strong speaker, it needs to come from an invitation to speak.
[00:18:02] I can't just speak to speak because that's actually coming from what we call the not self. And that can receive not only not negative attention, but not. any attention, honestly. And then you feel like you're kind of like screaming into the void. When I figured that out for myself, then I was like, Oh my God, why then I need to just wait for invitations.
[00:18:25] People like, Mel, what do you think? Or, you know, it's not even a, now it's your turn to speak. But I think again, As a, I almost want to say like a former woman in business, um, for identification purposes, you're taught to just be like, you need to put your point across. Like you need to, if the table is not there, you need to build a table.
[00:18:45] Well, yes. And you also need to make sure that as a room you want to design. And if you're just in there to just be this, you know, energy, then you need to set a little bit of time, like, what is my intention here? And it's okay to wait to see if this is really the right space for you to speak. Again, knowing your audience, or if you're like, you know what?
[00:19:10] Not my time, not my circus, not my monkeys. We're just going to smile and nod and move on. I love that. And actually, and so, you know, the interesting thing is that you live that. So I invited you onto this podcast. You didn't pitch me. I invited you and I have a, um, a defined. Throat, so I'm just out here talking all over the place, and that feels really great for me.
[00:19:36] Yeah, because it's coming from a place that is, that's where you process your information. So, and again, it's, you're, there's still those layers, right, of knowing your strategy, you know, those things as well that we can, again, totally go down massive rabbit holes, but it is those little things when you know those little triggers or identifiers about yourself.
[00:19:57] It's so crazy how much you can catch yourself doing things just out of routine and even just questioning why did that, who even told me that to begin with, did they even know me or was this just another copy and paste formula that a mentor or a coach or a peer told me that I just took as, you know, the golden rule and ran with it without taking a minute and go, okay, how does that really check in with me, my identity, my passions, my morals, all those things.
[00:20:26] Yeah, so what are some ways or what are maybe some challenges that people face when they're trying to align their identities with their career goals and ensuring that they are in the right room that they want to either join the table or build the table? Yeah. Well, I think some of the, I think probably the biggest challenge per se is the fact that careers come with titles, titles come with expectations, and we have no idea who set those expectations to begin with.
[00:21:00] And therefore, we try to match what we think or who we think we need to be to hit those expectations. So. I always say this, no matter if you're an entrepreneur or in the corporate space, understand what the title really means to you and ask them, what is this title? What does this actually mean? Like when you say project manager, really give me details of, you know, what are my expectations?
[00:21:26] What are my responsibilities? What, you know, this, that, the other, and see how that actually meshes with your With you and take time to sit with it. Like it's great to be like, Hey, I'm a, you know, general manager, you know, Hey, I'm CFO. That's great. Titles. Do you have meaning and weight to them? But those weights can turn into something that can pull you down.
[00:21:53] If you don't really understand. how you can make that role yours. Yep. And again, when you know your strengths, your stopping points, because I don't like to say, you know, uh, now I can't even think of the negative term, but your stopping points to where you need to delegate to where you need to, you know, let go.
[00:22:14] Then you can really make those into something that is yours, as opposed to walking into a role, having somebody tell you, okay, you have to do it this way, this way, this way, this way. And then that's the way it has to be done. And that actually can be turned around to the leaders as well. Leaders giving your employees room to make their processes theirs.
[00:22:36] It's finding those what are those non negotiables, right? Deadlines are obviously one of them. If there's certain milestones or expectations they need to hit in a certain time or certain aspects, make sure that those are definitely set. But give your employees the room to work the way that they Like to work.
[00:22:56] Yeah. And there is some pushback, right? Like any other relationship, it's having that communication of, I communicate best this way. I work best this way. If you can at least give me this. Right. Like I think that there's some mishap in that in corporate, especially. As we get into these, like, this is my lane, this is your lane, we only intersect when we need to, just, you know, don't ask me stupid questions, at least this has been my experience, just do it, and then when I do it wrong, you're not going to tell me until I've completely done it all, and then you throw me under the bus, right?
[00:23:28] So, it's. Everybody just understanding how they best work, how they best communicate. Because when you have those conversations and those, those expectations and those non negotiables, because when you know those things and you have a beautiful conversation about them, all of a sudden everybody starts working together without even really thinking about it instead of just setting these expectations onto somebody, letting go and then looking back going, what the fuck, like, why?
[00:23:55] Why isn't anybody doing anything? Well, you didn't really, you kind of set it and forget it. We're not like an easy bake oven. Right. Yeah. You know, absolutely. I, I talk to, to leaders about this all the time about when we're delegating, when you're delegating things out. Like, first of all, it's, it's like a big, like.
[00:24:12] Mindfuck to get people to even delegate, first of all, a lot of times, because people are like, no, I have to hold on to everything because I'm the leader and I need to do it all. But whenever we do get them to delegate, then we have to get to a place of, what are your expectations? What does good look like?
[00:24:28] And where, where can we let people just go do their thing? Right. And do it, do it the way that that makes sense to them. And I'll say to people, like, is this a preference for you? Or is this a requirement that it has to be done this way? So, like, to your point, yeah, deadlines, you as a leader, probably setting a deadline, you know, again, what does good look like?
[00:24:49] What are those kind of, you know, You know, must haves non negotiables, but after that, let your people go do their thing. We're hiring professionals and we're hiring, you know, adults to go, to go do work, like let them go do the, let them go do the work. And the more we're able to allow people to like lean into those gifts and strengths and just their own way of operating, the better product you're going
[00:25:16] to get at the the more that you understand. Your strengths and your stopping points and the way that you also like to not only delegate, but be delegated to and have and communicate that. I think that's the other thing we, like most relationships, a lot of us naturally assume. Well, they just, they should just know, or I just, you know, I I've dropped them hints.
[00:25:37] I'm sure they figured it. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Like you need to be able as an individual. Know yourself, know your boundaries, and be able to express those in a way that is, that is collaborative, but healthy. And the more that you do know, the more you do know yourself, the more you, like we mentioned before, embrace those different identities, those strengths, those stopping points.
[00:26:06] When you look at job opportunities or even a business opportunity, if you're an entrepreneur, you can say, okay, I know this to be true. Like that's one of my favorite checking questions. What do I know in this moment to be true? And then looking at that, what are the questions I need to have to get more information to make sure that I am making the right, the best decision?
[00:26:25] I don't think there's right or wrong decisions. The best decision. Yeah. And again, in human design that actually comes from certain spaces in your body. It's not your mind. It's not your heart, by the way, those two not decision makers. Um, so even knowing your strategy inside of that, I need to make sure that I have this information so I can do this just to make sure that this is actually sitting with me and if you say yes, and if you move through it and all of a sudden you're like, this is not what I needed.
[00:26:52] That's okay too. Like most of us have to have those experiences in order to understand what now is the best decision for me. Because with new information. Comes new and comes new decisions. And so again, embracing your identities, knowing where you can be them safely and respectfully and know how those identities and those strengths and stopping points are so valuable to any space.
[00:27:24] And then really just honoring where those, where, excuse me, honoring which spaces those will be completely embraced. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Kind of like the, the idea of go where you're celebrated, not just tolerated. Yes. Yeah, totally. Yeah. So, okay. So as like the employee, as ourselves. We need to know ourselves first.
[00:27:49] We need to kind of dig into understanding our own identities, how we best work, what our gifts and strengths are, and then figuring out where are those rooms and where are those spaces where we can, where we can show up and fully embrace those identities. Now, as a leader though, how can I help support my own employees in feeling safe in order to, in bringing their, all of their identities to work and their ways of, of operating to work?
[00:28:16] How do I, how do I as a leader, um, create that environment for them? I'm a huge believer in leadership by energetic and actionable example. If you are a person that already is bringing their full selves to work and utilizing your tools for yourself and have already kind of molded your role to you, honestly, you will naturally attract and be an example to everybody else besides you, below you, above you, what have you.
[00:28:49] And that gives you a little bit more, um, permission to know how to utilize your space. But if for some reason you don't, then it really is starting with you, you know, it's like understand yourself as well as talk to the team that you already have, have a beautiful conversation with them. It doesn't have to be anything like super spiritual pow wowie, whatever, but just be like, Hey guys, I would like to know what are your strengths?
[00:29:16] What are your stopping points? What are your expectations? And how do I identify with this role in the team? Because I think you will be hopefully pleasantly surprised, but definitely surprised in people's responses. And then from there, you could actually create a different system of process. You can then see, Oh, this whole time I thought you really love spreadsheets.
[00:29:38] Apparently you don't, you're just good at copying pasting, but this person really does. So let's flip this and let's see, or maybe there's another way that we can do this. I think being open in your communication. open in how your processes actually go and molding them with the team that you have, as well as understanding what is it that you, that you bring to the table.
[00:30:05] And are you being that example? That's, um, that, that people can just naturally follow with. Yeah, absolutely. We have to start with ourselves as leaders to, to model, to model that behavior. But also I, sometimes I'll see leaders be like, well, this is, this is how I communicate. This is how I lead. This is how I influence.
[00:30:29] Therefore, everybody else should do it the same way, which is, which is totally the wrong way to be thinking about. Thinking about all of this, like, yes, like start with the work yourself and identify kind of all of, all of, you know, your, your value add ways, but then recognize that that's not going to look the same for everyone else.
[00:30:47] And that's okay. And that's okay. So that's the other kind of piece that us as leaders need to make sure we're also reminding ourselves about. Yeah, definitely. And it's, it's, yeah, giving yourself grace. Just understanding that we're no human is an operation manual. Nobody, we are not, you know, cogs in a wheel where we are human beings that have, and I think that was, I think that was, uh, brought a little bit more forward, especially during, um, BLM.
[00:31:18] And like there are outside factors that are mentally and emotionally affecting people in our company, in our business, in our lives, in our, in our circles. How can we create a space? That gives them the space to process that like, and, and being able to honor those, you know, those shifts and honor, you know, those mental health shifts that we've all been having, but especially become more, um, I don't want to say sexy, but definitely has been a top of point conversation since 2020.
[00:31:54] And really understanding what that means, and how can we just remind each other that we are humans first. Yes. And, you know, yes, we are here to do a job, but if you don't have a human who is available to do the job, the job's not going to get done. So how can you shift things to give everyone the space to, with their individuality and with their identity, Get done what they, you know, are asked to get done, but in the time and space that they actually have the capacity for that's, you know, that works within the timeframe that you have.
[00:32:29] Absolutely awesome. Now, this has been, I feel like we've covered a lot of ground here, but this is for a short suite. Um, this, this has been, this has just been so, so good and oh my gosh, we could do multiple episodes around identity and work and all of this. Mm-hmm. . But if someone wanted to kind of dive into their own identities, dive into their own human design, like, where can we find you?
[00:32:55] Where can we get more, more from you? Yeah. So you can check out my website, which is mel mcsherry.com. I'm also on LinkedIn. Same name, Mel McSherry. Um, or feel free to, uh, I would say respectfully stalk me on Instagram, Mel underscore McSherry, but yeah, those are probably the best places to just see more of what I do, get to know me a little better.
[00:33:17] And I always love to offer if anybody would like to have a conversation, um, if this sparked anything that they would like to ask me questions or dig a little deeper on, I'm more than happy to have a complimentary 30 minute virtual coffee. Um, so there's that link available as well, and I'd be happy to.
[00:33:31] Chat with you and get to know you better. Yeah. Well, and we'll link all of that in the show notes. So, so yeah, if anyone wants to just get private time with Mel, I mean, even just in a 30 minute conversation, oh my gosh, that'll be, I'm sure really, really, um, really, really valuable for you. So again, all of that you can find out on the show notes.
[00:33:49] You can find links, links to that there. Well, again, Mel, thanks so much for, for today. This was so, so wonderful. And I'm just honored just to have you, um, have you in my life. Thank you. Thank you. And thank you so much for having me. This was, this was definitely a bright spot of my day, so I appreciate you so much.
[00:34:08] And this podcast and the work that you're doing is amazing. Thanks so much. Awesome. Thanks. Well.
