Episode 16: Healing From Burnout & Toxic Work Environments
APPLE PODCASTS │ SPOTIFY │ GOOGLE PODCASTS
A recent study from Deloitte found 77% of employees are experiencing burnout in their current workplace. If you are experiencing burnout and in a toxic work environment, know you are not alone and it is not your fault. But your family can see and feel how this is affecting you and so can future employers when you are on interviews.
On today’s episode, therapist turned career coach, Jessica Sweet is sharing:
Different reasons employees burnout at work
How your experience impacts your relationships at home
When to fix the system and when to walk away
Job searching while healing from workplace trauma
Where to find Jessica and learn more about working with her:
Jessica’s new group coaching program
Full Transcript:
[00:01:05] Nicole Case: Hi everyone. Welcome back to the Upgraded Career Podcast. I'm your host Nicole Case, and today I am joined by my friend and colleague, Jessica Sweet, who is another career coach and a therapist who is coming on today to talk to us about a really, really important topic. We're talking about burnout and toxic.
Workplaces, and I know I personally have experienced this in my career. Many of my friends, colleagues, clients have also experienced this. So I'm so, so glad to have Jessica here with us today just to kind of talk us through what all this is and how we can work through it. So Jessica, welcome to the show.
[00:01:43] jessica_sweet: Thank you so much, Nicole. I'm super glad to be
[00:01:47] Nicole Case: this having that I know, I know The, the, the fun part about having uh, uh, an online kind of coaching business in this way is there's such an amazing community of other practitioners and experts and coaches out there, particularly on LinkedIn. So I know I talk, I'm always talking to my clients about, about their LinkedIn profiles and being active there.
It's just such a really warm, lovely, lovely community there. I've had nothing. Amazing experiences and it's, it's, it's awesome. I love, again, this, this kind of community is great because if, you know, someone comes to me and wants some support and I'm like, well, you know what, I think, I think you should go talk to Jessica.
I think you know, she, she's probably gonna be the best coach for you at this time, and vice versa. Like there's a lot of that. Client sharing back and forth and referrals that's happening, which is, um, again, also just a lovely way to ensure that the people out there who, who need our help and our support and our guidance are, are getting the exact type of support and guidance that they need.
[00:02:55] jessica_sweet: Exactly. Yeah, that's exactly right. Because there's so many people, unfortunately right now that need. Guidance and support. I mean, there's so much going on in the workplace and careers and so,
[00:03:08] Nicole Case: Yeah.
[00:03:08] jessica_sweet: there is
know,
you know
[00:03:17] Nicole Case: So, okay. So tell me,
[00:03:19] jessica_sweet: a
[00:03:20] Nicole Case: um, just a little bit about your career journey. Again, like you said, you're a coach and you're a therapist. So kind of tell us a little bit about that career journey and just kind of how you, how you came to support. Specific people out there who are suffering from workplace burnout and toxic workplaces.
[00:03:37] jessica_sweet: Yeah, absolutely. So, um, I started out. as you said, as a therapist. So I, um, I have a Master's in social work. Um I trained at, uh, a Harvard, um, affiliated teaching here in Boston, um, for my, my therapy training. Um, I did that work
for probably
about 10 years. And then
I had my first daughter and um basically
I
got kicked outta the workforce because
my pay was so low that it didn't make sense to go back in, um, because I'd just be forking that over for, for daycare. So I, I actually really loved that
work I loved what I was
doing Um but I just, I couldn't really afford to, to keep doing it.
So I stayed home for
a little bit with
[00:04:27] Nicole Case: Yeah
[00:04:28] jessica_sweet: then I, you know, the
whole time I thinking
you know what, what can I do
I really
feel called to do that I, you know, that I wanna do, and I could have
hung out my shingle as a therapist,
right And and started a
private practice. But I really didn't wanna do that. what I discovered through my own kind of process of, of soul searching is that I
really wanted to coach people
and,
um I wanted to coach people on
figuring
out like what their own,
sort gifts to give to
the world.
were like what what
was their brilliance?
How could they get
that brilliance back?
How could they do that And it evolved over time
into specifically career and then, um,
evolved even
more into, um,
you know, helping
people different aspects of
their career and
particular helping
people,
um who
have suffered really
difficult work situations.
Not all my clients are
in that situation but
lots of my clients have,
uh struggled with, you know, difficult situations like toxic places have, you know, have been, uh,
in burnout situations
So, The reason
that I think I ended
up there and it
it really wasn't a conscious but it, it
I think because
story is that I grew up with a dad who
really really hated
his job, and he was
in a toxic workplace
for about
30 years and he was
totally burned out, but, you know, felt like he had no choice and no other options.
So he went to work every day. You know, did that for a really long time. And then he had a dramatic rage quit when I was probably
like 18
Uh, it was like a shocking thing for
for man who
went to
work every day for 30
years
despite like all these physical symptoms and all these emotional symptoms,
he like persevered
through everything.
And then one day he just was home cuz he had a
rage quit and that was it. He never went back. So, You know, in my journey, you know, looking back I was like, okay, that's why I ended up here. Right? Like, but it wasn't conscious.
It wasn't like, okay,
you know I'm gonna, I'm gonna heal this inner
wound of my own and, that's, where I ended
[00:07:02] Nicole Case: Yeah.
You know, I can so relate to that story and, and I share with others that
[00:07:07] jessica_sweet: a
[00:07:07] Nicole Case: a lot of the reasons, you know, one of the main reasons why I do the work that I do is similar, that my dad worked in a job that he hated. I wouldn't go as far as to say that he, it was toxic or he, it was burnout. He, he was burned out from it and he certainly didn't rage quit.
Um, but I know that he, he, um, felt like he had to. This work because that's what was gonna pay the bills and put food on the table for his family. He was a mechanic by trade and that's what he loved to do. Al similar to what you said, that there wasn't a lot of, lot of money to be had there. And so he, uh, you know, he shifted into a labor job, uh, building roads in Pennsylvania and um, and, you know, worked his way up and was, you know, running all kinds of heavy equipment.
And, you know, that's a real skill, but it wasn't what he liked. It's not what he wanted to do, and it required him being away from his family a lot. when he did come home, when he was home, he was miserable and I was just like, this is it. This is what, this is what works. This is what work is. I was like, really?
And I don't know if I was just, you know, this naive, wide-eyed young kid at the time and I'm total and I totally still am this, that it's just like, I just don't think that that's what work should be. I mean, we're already spending so much time there and away from our families. You know, there's gotta be a better way to do this work thing.
And so that's kind of what led me to do. I was doing career coaching at, um, at Penn State when I was a, when I was a student there, and then I was like, oh, well I would love to go, continue to do career coaching, and decided to get my master's degree in hr so I could like, kind of do both things. I could help people.
you know, in corporate, in their workplace, you know, have a better experience at work. Um, and then I shifted back. I kind of went full circle and came back out, um, to do career coach, career coaching, full-time and leadership coaching full-time. So like, I totally, I totally relate to that story. Like watching, watching our parents like go through.
such a terrible experience. Like really, that really impacts us as kids. Right? And you know, I think so many people that might be listening to this who are parents, um, you know, if you are in a toxic work environment and you're getting burnout, your kids are seeing that whether you say it or not, right?
Whether, like you said, like, you know, he just came home one day, he had raged quit like it was. . It just happened. Right. And like your kids are seeing that and your kids are remembering this as they're growing up. Like, is this the type of, is this the type of memory or the type of experience you want your kids to even have alongside you as you're, as you're trying to navigate a workplace like this?
[00:09:51] jessica_sweet: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, and, and as you can imagine, and it sounds like as you lived, you lived through in your own experience. is
[00:09:59] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:10:00] jessica_sweet: that led up to that whole, whole experience for me, right? Like the every day of him being miserable, um, you know, that it's, it's a difficult situation. So, yeah, I agree.
Like the
[00:10:15] Nicole Case: Yeah
[00:10:15] jessica_sweet: experiencing
[00:10:16] Nicole Case: totally right
[00:10:17] jessica_sweet: know, it doesn't
[00:10:20] Nicole Case: which
All so an important topic again, is why I'm so, so, happy that you're here. So
[00:10:31] jessica_sweet: so
[00:10:31] Nicole Case: you share just what are some of the main causes of burnout at work and maybe what are some of the signs that you might be approaching burnout earlier that you're already there?
[00:10:42] jessica_sweet: Yeah Yeah. So I mean I think a lot of of times burnout comes from um
a couple main
things So one is
obviously
Just being
overworked having
way too much on your plate. But,
uh another piece is sometimes not
having the autonomy um,
to really kind
of say what you, what you wanna do,
like what you wanna have control over.
um or how you get to
to, do
what you're doing. Um, because a lot of people
I talk to
you know, they'll say, know, I wanna
[00:11:21] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:11:23] jessica_sweet: I you know, I wanna do bigger things. I wanna make an impact.
Right So
it's not necessarily
the more work
that's
the problem It's not, it's not just that by itself. the more work in the context
of not being able
to have
control over what that work is. How that
work gets done whether
your voice is heard around it and whether there are boundaries around it. So like getting a call at like,
you know two
in the morning from your boss, demanding that you do something that
[00:11:52] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:11:53] jessica_sweet: to you, right?
Like that, those, that's a setup for burnout because you're, you, it's just like, you feel like a victim in the
situation rather than feeling like an actor in the situation feeling like you
[00:12:06] Nicole Case: Mm
[00:12:07] jessica_sweet: control
and and
autonomy. So, I think that that's really a setup for burnout,
um signs that you might be getting
[00:12:19] Nicole Case: Mm mm-hmm
[00:12:20] jessica_sweet: it
it's, it feels like,
um
you know,
depression it feels
like apathy. Um, it can feel like physical symptoms.
um
you know, um, and
disengagement with
the work. Like really
just like blah I
don't wanna do this
anymore Um so those those
[00:12:42] Nicole Case: Yeah
you said that
Yeah I can totally, I can totally relate to that. And I actually, I love how it's not about people not wanting to do work, it's wanting they wanna do work that matters to them. Work that probably leans into their strengths, you know, work that, you know, you talked about, um, having some autonomy over.
over the work that they're doing and probably the flexibility to do it in the way that they think is, is the best way to do it. So they don't have just, you know, this leader or this boss just looming over them, telling them how, you know, micromanaging everything to death. Right. Yeah Yeah Yeah
[00:13:29] jessica_sweet: and
[00:13:33] Nicole Case: totally. So, so speaking of agency with companies doing layoffs,
[00:13:38] jessica_sweet: they and
[00:13:38] Nicole Case: pressure to return to the office, concern about recession, I'm hearing so much about companies asking their employees to do more with less. So we've talked about like, you know, companies themselves are not setting up our employees, their employees for success around this and really contributing to burnout.
But what part do we own in all of this? Because it can really feel like, uh, you know, I'm, I'm. A victim in all of this that I can't control any of this, but what parts do we control? Because I know in my own personal burnout story, I controlled most of it actually like it. Um, in, in certain situations I was in a toxic work environment, but in a lot of situations where I was burning myself out, I was imposing that on myself.
So can you kind of talk a little bit about like how much we can contribute to our own burnout versus a toxic work?
[00:14:27] jessica_sweet: Yeah absolutely And I think that you're bringing up a good point Um you can burn out in a in a work environment that is not toxic. And I think those are two very distinct
things
Um, so the, you're being asked to do more with
less in many environments
that
are not that that
you might
not consider toxic but they're
just stretched really thin. Um, so in terms of what you can do in an
[00:14:57] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:14:59] jessica_sweet: You know,
[00:15:00] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:15:01] jessica_sweet: a
big part
is two pieces. One is self-care, and I guess
the second piece is kind of contained in that
and
that's boundaries right? self-care is, know, really considering what. what
self-care looks like for you
[00:15:18] Nicole Case: Mm
[00:15:18] jessica_sweet: that actually mean for
you.
What
helps you feel better
Um,
is it getting
exercise? Is it hanging out with your friends? Is it leaving work at five o'clock? Like, what is it that you can
implement
that's gonna help you
feel rejuvenated? and then the other thing is boundaries. So
you know, when you're being stretched
thin boundaries difficult
if you can communicate with your manager,
um and
say, you know, okay, know, I
understand I have to do one and
a half jobs or two jobs,
I am
still one person, I
am not gonna work Saturday
[00:15:57] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:15:58] jessica_sweet: I'm not gonna work past 6:00 PM and. you know, everything has to
go through email and
not text, right?
Like trying to set boundaries is
one way that can you can try
to reduce the burnout because if you've got everything coming at you from all channels 24 7, it's really not possible to, to feel calm and rejuvenated ever.
You really have to
[00:16:24] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:16:25] jessica_sweet: to turn
off And if you think
about the word burnout, it really is, it's like
it's like you've got a light bulb on
all the time, right?
And eventually it's burnout.
So you need
[00:16:34] Nicole Case: Yeah I
[00:16:36] jessica_sweet: can
[00:16:43] Nicole Case: And love how you said
about,
[00:16:45] jessica_sweet: recover
[00:16:46] Nicole Case: rejuvenating.
[00:16:48] jessica_sweet: a way
[00:16:48] Nicole Case: know, I have, I definitely have a love-hate relationship with. This concept of self-care, right? Which we could do a whole other episode just on self-care. Right? Um, but, you know, but what, what that does look like for you and, and for some, it, some people it is going to the spa in bubble baths and pedicures.
And for other people it's, you know, Spending time with their fr your friends or reading or, you know, shutting it off at five o'clock, you know, whatever that is. I love how you said rejuvenate, and that's really what we're talking about when we're saying self-care. It's not pampering ourselves, which that might be part of it.
If, for you, if that, if that works for you. I know that's definitely works for me. Spa days are so, are nice for me. I love them, but um, but yeah, like how can you feel rested and rejuvenated? , you know, what does that, what does that look like for you? And you, you've talked, talked a lot about boundaries. I love that.
Um, we talked about boundaries back on episode, um, episode 12 and 13. So for those of you listening, you wanna go back and, and listen to those around how to, how to set boundaries That ties in nicely with, with this con, with this conversation here. So, so all of that to say that, , there are some things that we can control.
All is not lost. There are some things that, that we can control. Um, but what if, what if you do find yourself in a toxic work environment? How can you, what's some advice that you have for those who are experiencing a toxic work environment? What are some steps that they can take to advocate for themselves or maybe initiate some change within the organization?
[00:18:22] jessica_sweet: Yeah So
[00:18:23] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:18:26] jessica_sweet: You know is to of look at your own safety because,
um you know
to
toxic work
environments
can sometimes include physical
abuse which you
know, really, you really
have to look at your own as really
first That's the concern is
your own
safety
Um, the second thing
is
if it seems
reasonable to you.
Sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't.
To have a conversation with you
know, your manager or, or hr,
whoever seems
appropriate. Um, a place seems so
dysfunctional that it just
it is just like
a lost cause and you're
just like okay this place is just on fire
Um, you do
wanna document everything
that's happened.
All
the people,
what was done what said date time everything
Um, so that you have a
record of it If were to happen in
[00:19:33] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:19:35] jessica_sweet: HR
or anything legal,
wanna have a record
that you can rely
on for one fax
because your brain
is not reliable under the best of
circumstances right And
And, and, under these circumstances, definitely not.
also
You know, you, you, you just want, you
wanna have a hard record like that.
I
think you.
Other
people
[00:20:01] Nicole Case: Mm
[00:20:02] jessica_sweet: disagree with this, but I, I
don't advocate for spending a lot of
time, um,
trying to change the
system. I, I think
for
most
people from the, your seat
in um, an organization, it's very very
hard to change that.
Um d you know, depending on where you are in the
organization but it can be nearly, IM. and it takes a lot of blood, sweat, and tears
to to
make even a small change. And you have to ask yourself whether you
want to invest that
is that worth it to you to change this organization?
[00:20:37] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:20:38] jessica_sweet: so the answer might be yes, but if it's not, if you don't actually care that much
[00:20:43] Nicole Case: Yeah
[00:20:44] jessica_sweet: care about
is feeling better
and
[00:20:46] Nicole Case: Mm.
[00:20:48] jessica_sweet: you know, you might just consider moving on.
there's a lot of guilt around that sometimes.
Um but you can also to the your coworkers
or, or other
[00:20:59] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:21:00] jessica_sweet: know what their options
are as well.
um
so those are some ideas. I mean, there's a lot more things that we could get into, but those are some
things that you can think about
Um,
you
know, to
[00:21:21] Nicole Case: Yeah
[00:21:21] jessica_sweet: that
[00:21:22] Nicole Case: I totally,
[00:21:23] jessica_sweet: to
[00:21:23] Nicole Case: I to, I hear that from clients. I know, I've personally experienced that in my own career at a particular organization that was incredibly toxic. Um, that, you know, I walked away from that experience feeling like I was a failure, like it was my fault. especially, especially in from my seat personally being in hr, like I feel like I failed the employees at that company because I was an, I was not able to turn it around.
Like I, I spent lots of time having a lot of guilt and shame around that, to be perfectly honest. And I, I love, I love hearing you say that. in no uncertain terms, none of this was your fault, , none of this was your fault. And, um, and, and I'm sure you see this with your clients and I see it with, with mine who are coming to me with this particular situation, that they're just so down and so low at this point that it's just like, You know, there's, there's some, there's some steps there that you need to take to heal with a therapist.
That, that's, that's, you know, not in my wheelhouse. So I'm always ensuring that my clients have access to, to a therapist. So, um, your clients are particularly, particularly fortunate to have you have you and their corner to help support them through, through some of this. Um, but I, I would love to hear though, about what, if you're a.
in an organization, like maybe you do have a seat. Right? And a lot of people who listen to this podcast, that's where they're at. They do have a seat at the table. They, they are in a position of authority and influence, you know, what are some advice, what's some advice for, for a leader that, um, that they can either address the, to the work, the toxic workplace, or they can prevent, uh, you know, a toxic workplace from, from happening in, in the first place under their.
Mm-hmm
[00:23:14] jessica_sweet: Yeah Yeah. I mean I'm gonna preface all this by saying it's extremely extremely difficult Um I've worked with many, many
leaders I mean, I, I, you know, I've
[00:23:24] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:23:25] jessica_sweet: who are in
midlife and in leadership
positions and, um, it's still very hard from that seat
to make a difference because it, you know, you
are one person.
Um
that's my preface to this answer, but I think it, it's always, um,
communication So it really needs
to start
with getting clear on
your own
your own head what's happening that
is, that
feels toxic to
you So again documentation
you. know, what's happened,
what what feels toxic what's
going wrong, and then, you know,
finding
allies.
You know, who
else is this happening to? Who else is experiencing
this can you get
those other people to speak out?
getting HR involved
if
possible if
that feels like
something that makes sense to do And then
know,
having conversations with the
toxic know, one person
or several people bringing to
the table solutions. um,
whether that is you know change in communication
style, change
in policy change
in systems, um,
bringing in different leaders, that might be. you know,
it's it can be very, very hard
for
[00:25:03] Nicole Case: I
yeah, So yeah even, even as a leader, it's, it's still.
[00:25:10] jessica_sweet: that
[00:25:10] Nicole Case: incredibly difficult, but
I I, do love that you said that. Go find other people. Go find other allies and, and, um, supporters inside the organization. Because what happens, what I, what I would see a lot of, um, is that people think when they're, we're in this, when they are in this toxic work environment for a period of time, they feel like they're alone in this.
That they feel like nobody else is feeling this. I'm the only one that's experiencing this. And it like, they like gaslight themselves almost to like, you know, feel or Well, and I think that sometimes at toxic work environments, that's their goal, right? Is to isolate people and to make people feel like.
you're the only one that feels this way. No one else is saying this stuff. No one else, um, you know, has this perspective that you have. And so it makes you start to question your sanity. Right? And, um, and so I'm just, I'm just echoing what you're saying is just go find it, go find some other allies, because if you're feeling this way, it's highly, highly likely.
Other people are too. And they are also just in this little bubble at the moment, feeling like they're the only ones. And. Um, so like you said, if it's really hard to change a huge system like this as one person, but the, the more people you can rally around, um, either those are the people who can support you in the interim as you're, as you're creating your exit strategy or, you know, that's how, that's how you create big change in an organization is, is with more people.
Yeah. . So, um, so tell me just a little bit about how you are specifically working with your clients who are experiencing burnout or trying to get out of a toxic work environment. How are you supporting them specifically?
[00:26:53] jessica_sweet: Yeah so there's a couple levels um that I that I work with people on Um
the first um, just kind of the
the mental Trauma the emotional support
piece.
Um because like you said feel really alone
Um, they feel
like it was their fault
Um, they are kind of really low. Um,
when
they're either in or
[00:27:23] Nicole Case: Hmm
[00:27:24] jessica_sweet: of a
situation like this
So, helping
to heal that is one of the pieces. And I, it, it does, this
doesn't happen in like you
know, step one,
step two step three, it kind of
all happens
Um, but that's, that's one of the things that really needs to happen is to, is to heal from that and recover and
and help people
remember that.
Um
they are actually. you know, great people. I mean, the,
the that
the problems
that were pointed
out or the issues like
it, it,
none of it's their fault Like it it's it's
not, it's not real. Um, so that's one.
[00:28:04] Nicole Case: Mm-hmm
[00:28:05] jessica_sweet: thing is, um, helping them either to.
Well
to make,
to make a decision. Like do they wanna
move on?
Do they wanna make,
you know, make changes in this organization?
And then um if they wanna move on, like how do they actually do that? So are they looking for a different
job Are they looking
for a different career? How do they make that change? And
how do they make that change, um, the place that they're at?
Because a lot
of times
know, they don't feel they,
you know, they
wouldn't buy themselves the marketplace right now given how
they're feeling, right? Like, they wouldn't hire
them cuz they feel
terrible. So
how do you get somebody back into fight and shape, so that they feel like they can go out there and advocate
for themselves They can
interview well
um,
they can say, yes, I can
do this job So getting somebody back to that point where they really do feel c.
And
giving them the
skills and the know-how to learn how to
job search in today's environment.
[00:29:08] Nicole Case: Jessica
[00:29:09] jessica_sweet: is the
[00:29:13] Nicole Case: fact
[00:29:14] jessica_sweet: So
[00:29:14] Nicole Case: Yeah. No, I, I love that, because again, we can't we can't, kind of gloss over the that. . If you are in this place where you are burnout, you're in a toxic work environment, you are experiencing trauma. Like you are, you are in a, what I used to say at at my previous organization that was like this.
I was in a, I was in an abusive relationship. Right? And they're and, and they're, even if you go into an interview or you're putting yourself out, To try to find something different
like
that's still oozing out of you, right? Like that trauma and that, um, that experience is just oozing out of you. And so you need someone like you, with your skills and your expertise in their corner to help them heal from that.
Get them like, like you said, back into fighting shape so that they. You know, go out into this job search, go out into this market and like really be on top of their game, right? Like it's, um, cuz job searching in the, in, even when you are already at the top of your game is already a challenging, um, a challenging endeavor.
So adding this on top of it, um, you really do need to seek out, if you're seeking out a coach, um, that, that somebody is, is, is really skilled in this area to really help you through. . Yeah. So, so tell us what do you have coming up next and, and where can we find you and learn more?
[00:30:42] jessica_sweet: Yeah So um you can find me um on my website it which is wishing well coach.com
and I am
starting a group program
for people who have experienced toxic
workplaces Um
and it does
involve the whole healing piece,
um helping people recover
um the
job search piece as well. So helping people get
back into that fighting shape and learn how to job search and,
and get to the place they know
what they wanna do and they can, um, identify. they wanna
[00:31:17] Nicole Case: Mm
[00:31:17] jessica_sweet: where
they'd be most, um, most valuable and get back into,
uh an organization
that's healthy. because
that's part of sort of
this
modified job search is
[00:31:30] Nicole Case: Thank you
[00:31:30] jessica_sweet: really like looking at, um, not only how do you get
yourself back into
the game, but how do you get. back into
a game you wanna be into.
[00:31:38] Nicole Case: Awesome
[00:31:39] jessica_sweet: that's,
Program, and So I'm super
[00:31:47] Nicole Case: Oh, I love that. That's so great because
a group container for something like that is just gonna.
So accelerate your healing process, right? Like being in a community with other people who are experiencing the same things that you are not necessarily inside of your same company
[00:32:04] jessica_sweet: Mm-hmm.
[00:32:05] Nicole Case: you can, um, you can kind of just support each other.
And again, just that feeling of being alone or that feeling of. Isolation that you're the only one that's going through this, that kind of goes away because, because you're in a group environment and everyone's there to do the same thing, to heal and to to move forward in a really positive way. I love that.
Okay, so, um, all of Jessica's links will be in the show notes out on Nicole k speaks.com/podcast/sixteen, so you'll be able to. See, see where everywhere you can find Jessica and learn more about her new group program coming up in April. So Jessica, so much thank you so much for being here today and talking, talking us through this really challenging and difficult, but such an important conversation.
[00:32:53] jessica_sweet: Thank you so much. You.
[00:32:55] Nicole Case: Thanks Jessica.
[00:32:57] Nicole: There are so many layers to this conversation around burnout and toxic workplaces that we could just not possibly cover them all here today. But what I want to tell you is that if you are experiencing burnout, And you're at a toxic workplace. I see you. I've been there. And know that you're not alone. You are not crazy.
And whether you decide to stay in your job or move on. You were going to need support from your family, your friends, your colleagues, and probably a therapist and a coach. Um, even if you are putting on a strong face for your family, they can feel how this is impacting you. And those relationships are just way too important to let your job negatively affect them.
So find your community, find your support and create a plan. To get out of the situation, whether by fixing it from the inside or just recognizing that it's a giant shit show and you decide to move on to a place. Where you are valued and respected. Like Jessica mentioned, she is launching a group program for people who are in the situation right now.
And want support healing from it and finding a new role out there. So I've listed all of her links in the show notes out at Nicole Case speaks.com/podcast/sixteen. So you can go out there and find all the information about that and about Jessica. But until next time remember your career deserves an Upgrade.
